Say that when you're a weekly watcher.

I mean I don't think it's unreasonable to be upset about something like Naruto having like 40 consecutive episodes of filler during the War Arc.

There's no point in watching something if you're just gonna skip stuff.

Except side quests don't actively get in the way of and delay the continuation of the story.

The filler episodes are still part of the anime story. Filler episodes are not the same as a side quest in a game. Skipping a filler episode is the same as skipping any other episode, because anime canon is different from manga canon. There's no point in watching a show if you don't watch all of it. A better game-related comparison would be if there was a video game where you didn't like one of the "worlds" that has levels in it because it doesn't really connect to anything, so you refuse to play that world. If you're playing a game but skip an entire world, I'd argue you haven't finished the game, and the same goes for skipping filler episodes. Filler episodes don't have to be bad you know, more time spent with characters I love should be fun.

One Piece really does have some banger filler. That Brook episode was good for his characterization.

I liked the time-travel fuckery of the Rainbow Mist filler, was neat how the book Robin was reading before the arc was about the Straw Hats in the past.

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No.

https://preview.redd.it/4kvnr8fg6hle1.png?width=731&format=png&auto=webp&s=be3933648a40cda269b06a3baee7f8efa5fc1f19

boo get off the stage.

> how necessary it can be

Just because you enjoyed them, found them immersing, does not mean they are necessery

Some say they are part of the experience in terms of you getting the vibe of one piece but I think that is a stretch.

I agree that one piece fillers are not bad. While for example Naruto's fillers are dogshit (esp the one after Pain's arc)

>12 episodes to grab the audience and the second season will be decided on viewership numbers.

The thing is, those moments should still be engaging and have: stakes, dramatic beats, and turning points. The effectiveness in making the audience care depends mostly on the type of writer and how they view those moments. I think a lot of those examples get flack for being boring because they're usually pretty superficial and the writers aren't doing much to earn the kind of light-hearted experience they're going for and they end up feeling hollow as a result.

EDIT: I've not seen much slice-of-life that I really connect with, but "Skip and Loafer" especially feels compelling because even if the external stuff seems tame, it does a great job of getting you to invest in the characters and their motives, so you understand how those seemingly mundane tasks and interactions are actually more meaningful.

>We got to see them for what they were and not just for what they were supposed to be within the story.

I think the character's actions within any scene should reflect more than just their role/archetype in the story anyway. If you can't get a sense of the character's personality and internal motives through the main story, then the problem is more due to the characters just being flat rather than they're not being enough beach episodes. If you need specific external stimuli to have characters act according to their personalities, then you don't really have strong characters. A well-defined character should be able to act according to their drives and personalities in most situations.

When you have characters with fleshed-out internal motives, you'll also have an easier time creating downtime moments because then the characters themselves will be motivated to prioritise other things that aren't strictly ending the plot. E.g. reacting to changes in the story and thinking about their next course of action, interacting with other characters based on their personalities, pursuing their other motives or doing things according to those motives that aren't about finishing the main plot, etc. You won't even need entire scenes to show those moments, let alone entire episodes.

Jjk needs it 😭

Mappa add spin off of jjk characters and my life is yours

Hot springs episodes can go to hell, I've had my fill with Persona series and will never forgive whoever invented this garbage misunderstanding trope that happens there.

...?

For original anime series?

Anime stopped doing filler because they stopped doing long-running series in general

The original Dragon Ball has pretty good filler. It fills in some training gaps and builds on the world a bit. Some of Dragon Ball Z's is fairly good (but not all of it).

Technically not a true "filler" arc, as the anime has it's own separate canon from the source material, but Season 3 of Sonic X is better than the rest of the show, makes me wish Cosmo and The Metarex appeared in the games, and it gave Tails some great development too.

The original 1999 version of Hunter x Hunter also had great filler that built on the characters, that second episode where Gon meets Leorio is great, so is the three episode arc where all the hunters get stuck on an island.

Gintama. Most of the time, people can’t tell the difference between its filler and canon stuff.

Some of the filler episodes are really good too and take advantage of it’s anime format.

One piece

Without binge watching and knowing filler Dbz was pretty decent. Garlic jr, just Goku and gohan enjoying life

There's a ton of fillers, so just by statistics, some were good and some were bad. Personally, I enjoyed most of them because they expanded on characters' background or contributed to the world-building.

I’m currently finishing up my re-watch of the canon part of OG naruto. I skipped the filler with Ibiki’s brother because it just made no sense to have Sasuke on a mission between his encounter with Itachi and leaving with the sound 4. I’m not sure if I will watch any of the filler before Shippuden.

I’ve never watched all of Shippuden so I’m excited to see some of the filler that expands on the manga

If you are saying filler only lasts 1 to 7 episodes then you are very early days in your rewatch.

Naruto and Shippuden are literally 40% filler.

Yes, there are the occasional single episodes or even minimal episode sections of filler that are pretty good. But in my opinion the filler completely ruined the pacing of the series as a whole.

The end of Naruto is when it really gets bad. There's like 70 episodes straight filler after the Sasuke retrieval arc.

Then in Shippuden basically every other arc is filler. And they aren't just up to seven episodes. There are like 20 to 40 episodes of filler at a time.

whats a filler anyways?

Because there are only that many main plot manga chapters. In recent years, Gosho draws no more 30 chapters a year, which converts to 20 episodes. That leaves 25-30 filler episodes to fill up the TV schedule.

It's a problem that any long anime have (Naruto, One Piece, etc), not just DC.

Even at "peak" production, only one chapter is produced per week. SImilarly, only one episode is produced per week. Generally speaking, each case is around 3-5 chapters, but an episode usually covers a full case (though there are two-parters occasionally). Thus, we usually get around 4 chapters per canon episode.

Mathematically, in order to continually produce episodes, a significant portion must be filler. Taking into account Gosho's recent extended breaks, this increases the ratio of filler to canon episodes.

EDIT: Actual Math: I was going by early DC before, whereas the newer episodes tend toward more episodes per case. According to this site there's been 562 canon episodes. This covers 1017 chapters, so on average, that's 1.8 chapters per canon episode. With 40 chapters not yet animated, and assuming Aoyama constantly producing 1 chapter/week, without breaks, this means that the anime would catch up in about 50 weeks if they only produced canon episodes. With his breaks, he's not producing that much, and I don't know what his actual schedule is, but if he alternated on a schedule of "5 weeks on, 5 weeks off," for example then it will catch up in only 31 weeks. If he doesn't do anything, it will catch up in about 22 weeks. (Of course, these calculations ignore reruns, remasters, and whatnot.)

Other long running series have also run into this problem, such as One Piece and Naruto. Due to their more continuous nature compared to DC's episodic nature, however, they are able to rectify this in different ways.

One Piece, for example, during a recent arc, had reduced to around one chapter per episode, sometimes less. Admittedly, this was detrimental to the pacing, but kept filler to a minimum. I've heard, though, that many would have preferred some filler in this case. This method probably wouldn't work well for DC.

At other times, there would be filler arcs, which would act as a buffer while more canon manga was produced. This is similar to DC's filler episodes, but on a much larger scale. I think, in cases like this, it's less egregious due to one 15-episode filler story being produced, rather than fifteen one-episode stories, despite taking the same amount of time.

Because the manga was delayed a lot in the last two years so they didn't want the anime to catch up to the manga storyline, they put in filler episodes

While I think you have a fair point, logistical commentary is a seperate category from narrative criticisms. Studios want to make profits, and the audience wants enjoyment. This is a time where they do to some extent clash but you can hold both opinions: fillers can make the audience get used to or attached the main cast more and animators should have reasonable schedules. Sure, maybe doing both is not feasible but how far the balancing act can go has more room for discussion (taking a year break, prioritizing the serious episodes for better animation, etc).

> so high that even filler has to match the main episodes in quality, or lest it get blasted on Twitter.

…is that the end of the world? There is an argument that lot of animes want to be Blue-Ray ready so filler episodes do take additional money to animate. But the main time I see people get mad at animation quality is when there is a drop of a previous established quality (e.g, between S1 and S2). Otherwise, I feel the reception isn’t all that hostile? It feels more like a “oh that’s so silly” and becomes a thing of endearment down the line.

Clearly we're in different spheres because I have never seen complaints about episode count. And if there was it is usually about pacing and adaptations being rushed.

Personally, I'm happy series are actually finishing and not just being in second season hell because the anime adapted the first novel out of 20+ volumes of an ongoing series.

It isn't exactly a zero-sum game.

Plenty of pro artist stuff would also lead to a better product. Like more flexible dead lines, making sure the anime is finished before it airs rather than during and so on.

Artists feeling trapped within a franchise feels like a pretty banal form of worker oppression compared to exploitative work hours and financial ripoffs.

Even Arthur Conan Doyle and L. Frank Baum felt dissatisfied with fans who kept asking for more of the same, but they did get nicely paid for surrendering to that, this is different from animators working in sweatshop conditions.

For me its easy.

I empathise with artists and creators. Not consumers.

Consumers are spoilt in a sea of endless content with ever inflating standards.

Artists and creators are desperately trying to survive and stay afloat in a saturated and aggressively competitive market.

Most consumers get fo enjoy amazing media. But only few artists will ever actually enjoy success.

The worst thing consumers will ever experience is a bad product that they paid for - which in some cases they can get refunded.

The worst thing artists will experience is having their life's work ripped apart under scrutiny, be abused by terrible working conditions, or in some cases, have their entire career and livelihoods upended due to AI.

Artists need to be protected and supported. Consumers will be fine. They can easily move onto whatever next thing that catches their interest.

These 2 things are nowhere near the same level.

Although there are good anime canon, i think some people take it too far when they say theres no filler in boruto and all the anime canon is great

To be clear naruto did use anime canon as well at points, both in expanding on existing arcs as well as adding content like the wedding stuff at the end of shippuden and the sasuke novel adaptation etc

Some of the anime canon in boruto is great all around, like adding backstory to Ao

Some anime canon has good parts or good premises. Like the stone and mist arc were great ideas for arcs and there were shining moments within each.

But they kinda start letting you down at the end or the middle. They often have pretty lackluster worldbuilding. Just visiting a village is not world building if nothing is added to that village and that village appears to be an empty generic location by the end of the arc. They also often try not to tie into the greater plot in a significant way. They’ll add custom villains that aren’t really gonna matter at all after the arc ends and that really didnt matter at all before the arc started. Which is a filler strategy and not something the canon should be limited to.

Furthermore they tend to be sporadic. Kinda randomly assigning different random genin an episode here or there without really giving any of these side characters and genin their own story arcs or plot threads to follow. A lot of one-offs that maybe get referenced and maybe dont. And often don’t get referenced by the canon. Which is filler writing and doesn’t need to be done by canon.

And some of it just straight up sucks like some of the more painful to watch chocho content or the genin teams that aren’t the main konoha 12 and only ever appear for 1-2 episodes in the entirety of the series. Or an episode where the whole episode is characters going on some wild goose chase that puts them back at square one by the end, and not only have the characters not changed and the plot not moved forward but it feels like nothing happened in general.

And its because of these things that some of the content is straight up filler. They literally don’t do any purpose other than fill time. Even a lot of anime canon is written to have a minimal effect on the plot and the characters so it still feels like filler, despite being allowed to be canon.

So yeah thats my ted talk on why im not impressed when i get one of these “boruto has no filler” notifications. Thats bullshit. It has good and bad anime canon as well as a decent chunk of filler.

Boruto creators learned from the mistakes of the Naruto filler, so its hard to compare the two when one is better due to the direct result of one being worse.

People get all hung up on what's "canon" and what's "filler" that they forget that this is all pretty subjective and individual. You can believe that everything is canon, and I can believe that the Urashiki isn't real and that's fine.

Whatever makes the viewing experience better for u homie.

I actually consider 2 types of anime canons:

• the original animal canon

• the manga extension anime canon

I dont mind the second one but the first type is really bland. You could say it is canon all you want but that doesnt mean it is not as poorly written as fillers and they are made in such a way so as not to impact the overall story (looking at you compressed rasengan).

It depends. I have not reached later episodes yet, but I heard the fillers are not as interesting as the canon material. However, if you were to watch Detective Conan from the beginning, I would really suggest the fillers. The episodes are thought out and you wouldn't think it wasn't canon. I would say the filler from the first episodes to around episode 500 is amazing! I can't recommend it more.

If you want to see the the list for Canon and filler episodes, there is one on animefillerlist.com.

https://www.animefillerlist.com/shows/detective-conan#google_vignette

As a manga reader who just started watching the anime, yes. Fillers are hilarious if you don’t mind about the lack of plot progression

"Fillers" are actually the main story. BO is the side story.

Early Conan filler is pretty good imo

I say they are worth watching, the idea of “filler” is a bit unique in the case of Detective Conan since a good amount of the manga could also be viewed as filler.

So watching anime only filler feels no different than reading a filler chapter of the manga. In fact a lot of times I forget whether or not a cases was in the manga or if it is anime only.